pakistan, north waziristan or frontier province as you are helping to protect american security. when you go after the taliban leadership, you are buying time in afghanistan. because, the film showed from marjah, when we went in there last winter, our marines, it was supposed to be all settled and the government in a box, perfect and that is a relatively small operation, bill, and now, comes kandahar and so, look, i'm not a defeatist. i want to us do well. but, the current policies, the counterinsurgency, we will not call a counterinsurgency, nation building we will not call nation-building, they do not and cannot work. bill: there is an old statement, if that is the case, i'll take it at face value, what you said, there is an old statement that says you cannot kill your way out of this. do you believe that to be true, even today. >> the question is kill your way out of what? in dealing with al qaeda you can kill your way out of it. in dealing with the taliban you probably can't kill your way out of the it.